Conviction Chapter 12 {Spoilers}

[kyli]

WOW!!! I gotta say, this chapter really blew me away!! So much happening at once!! Awesome work!!

Now, that said, I did wonder if Jason would consider to open the program for Jyslin but I didn't consider it likely. But if I had known that Jyslin would be the one to request it, I would have had a different opinion.

And Jason's (and the Parri's) ability to communicate with any other living beings is pretty amazing. That's how the Parri on Karis can communicate with the Parri in their home system I'm guessing. I need to continue thinking about the possibilities here.

And the precog revelation did catch me by surprise because I thought Fel wouldn't reveal it this chapter because of a comment he made on twitter. Evil man!

Now the plan to take-away all of the precogs from the Syndicate is clever. But if they do that, it can't be a bluff, which means that they have to set it up and put the plan in motion, and then put the stop switch into the hands of someone that will not stop from destroying the system unless the syndicate abandons it. Someone who will destroy the system and everything in it if the Syndicate remains behind. Otherwise the Precogs who are cooperating with the Syndicate will see through the bluff. I don't think, Jason, in particular, should be able to shut down it down. I suspect they will do it by making the star in that system go supernova. This should be manageable for the Karinnes. Stars are actually quite amazing in how they work. A stable star has an amazingly careful balance of forces, gravity and fusion, one seeking to implode, the other seeking to explode. A supernova happens when that balance is upset, usually when an old star starts running out of fuel and gravity wins, cause and huge implosion, followed by an explosion. I don't think it should be to hard for the Karinnes to upset the balance of forces in the star enough to create the supernova. Of coarse, we don't want to actually follow though with it but the Karinnes must still commit themselves to it in order for it to work.

And I wish I could be there to see the look on Sha Ra's face after Jason manages to kidnap the precog. And the look on the Syndicate CEO's faces when she reports how it happened. That will be just be epic and I really am hoping that Fel considers maybe giving us a POV from Sha Ra when this happens. But the way they do it, they could take over superships using the same method by having a Kimdroi take a homing beacon into the bridge of a supership and sending through troops to capture the bridge and take over the computer core and vent the ships atmosphere into space. There would still be resistance but it would be so much easier to take over the ship from the inside then from the outside.

Edit: they could also use the stable wormhole bridge to plant explosives in critical areas of the ship. Have the Kimdori plant homing beacons on as many superships as possible, near their powerplants or computer core and then have the Kimdori get out. Then create the wormholes and send a few anti-matter bombs through and destroy their ships one by one. They won't know what hit them. They could also just leave anti-matter bombs behind when they take the Oracle, and kill Sha Ra and her flag ship. She is really starting to sound like a bitch anyway.

[Hello World]

Now the plan to take-away all of the precogs from the Syndicate is clever. But if they do that, it can't be a bluff, which means that they have to set it up and put the plan in motion, and then put the stop switch into the hands of someone that will not stop from destroying the system unless the syndicate abandons it. Someone who will destroy the system and everything in it if the Syndicate remains behind. Otherwise the Precogs who are cooperating with the Syndicate will see through the bluff. I don't think, Jason, in particular, should be able to shut down it down. I suspect they will do it by making the star in that system go supernova. This should be manageable for the Karinnes. Stars are actually quite amazing in how they work. A stable star has an amazingly careful balance of forces, gravity and fusion, one seeking to implode, the other seeking to explode. A supernova happens when that balance is upset, usually when an old star starts running out of fuel and gravity wins, cause and huge implosion, followed by an explosion. I don't think it should be to hard for the Karinnes to upset the balance of forces in the star enough to create the supernova. Of coarse, we don't want to actually follow though with it but the Karinnes must still commit themselves to it in order for it to work.

Makes me wonder if Jason plans on breaking out the Starkiller bomb that was mentioned a couple of books ago. And yeah, the title of the book is making more and more sense. Not only does Karinnes need the conviction to guard and prevent the abuse of the FTL hyperspace tech, but he also needs to be able to restrain himself from handing out Generation upgrades, deal with the consequences of releasing the existence of the starkiller to at least a select few people, and possibly help the seers and prevent them from being abused by the people in the Milky Way.

They could also use the stable wormhole bridge to plant explosives in critical areas of the ship. Have the Kimdori plant homing beacons on as many superships as possible, near their powerplants or computer core and then have the Kimdori get out. Then create the wormholes and send a few anti-matter bombs through and destroy their ships one by one. They won't know what hit them. They could also just leave anti-matter bombs behind when they take the Oracle, and kill Sha Ra and her flag ship. She is really starting to sound like a bitch anyway.

Yeah, makes me wonder why they haven't done something like this before. Although it's possible that any explosives large enough to cause critical damage could not fit in the wormhole since unless you're a certain planet destroying space station, it would be stupid to have a point of failure where a single proton torpedo mobile bomb can wipe out your entire moon sized vessel. Even the Megatrons should be too large to fit through the wormhole and they're the most efficient weapon we've seen size-wise. Also, I wonder if it's possible to guard against this kind of thing since this would make espionage and sabotage way too easy. Heck I could even see people like the consortium trying to use it to invade Karis. Myleena did mention how making some type of spatial flux generator could destabilize a wormhole but who knows?

[Belgarion213]

Speaking of the One Man Wormhole, I'm just thinking that Jason should be REALLY careful about how he explains that to people outside of the house. I mean can you imagine the thoughts of people around the galaxy at the fact that Jason can do this at all? They are going to drop into the middle of a moon's worth of security to abduct a single person. Its only the fact that Jason isn't trying to expand the house at all costs, and that he likes her that stops him from say...doing the same thing and yanking the Empress from Draconus and so on. If that's not possible its going to occur to a lot of Intelligence workers as POSSIBLE.

[kyli]

Makes me wonder if Jason plans on breaking out the Starkiller bomb that was mentioned a couple of books ago. And yeah, the title of the book is making more and more sense. Not only does Karinnes need the conviction to guard and prevent the abuse of the FTL hyperspace tech, but he also needs to be able to restrain himself from handing out Generation upgrades, deal with the consequences of releasing the existence of the starkiller to at least a select few people, and possibly help the seers and prevent them from being abused by the people in the Milky Way.

Please, not that bomb again !!! I happen to agree with Jason that this bomb should never be built. I'm sure the karinnes could cause a supernova without resorting to that bomb. This "doomsday bomb", as i call it, leaves a HUGE tear in space that is both permanent and can move. And galaxies also move all the time. If the tear ever encounters a supermassive black hole, goodbye galaxy!!! Now in the short term, that isnt likely to happen, but in the long term, it very likely would. I would be disappointed if this bomb ever got built in the series.

Yeah, makes me wonder why they haven't done something like this before. Although it's possible that any explosives large enough to cause critical damage could not fit in the wormhole since unless you're a certain planet destroying space station, it would be stupid to have a point of failure where a single proton torpedo mobile bomb can wipe out your entire moon sized vessel. Even the Megatrons should be too large to fit through the wormhole and they're the most efficient weapon we've seen size-wise. Also, I wonder if it's possible to guard against this kind of thing since this would make espionage and sabotage way too easy. Heck I could even see people like the consortium trying to use it to invade Karis. Myleena did mention how making some type of spatial flux generator could destabilize a wormhole but who knows?

Only the Karinnes have the tech to make such a system a viable option. The consortium made a one-way wormhole but i doubt they could build a small stable two-way wormhole onto a enemy ship or planet. Jason did metion that its the bridge technology that makes this a viaible system. But a few antimatter bombs probably won't destroy a supership unless they explode near to the power plant and i expect that the Oracle is near the center of a supership and close enough to hit the power plant with a antimatter bomb. And that deep into the ship, armor would probably be non-existent.

Speaking of the One Man Wormhole, I'm just thinking that Jason should be REALLY careful about how he explains that to people outside of the house. I mean can you imagine the thoughts of people around the galaxy at the fact that Jason can do this at all? They are going to drop into the middle of a moon's worth of security to abduct a single person. Its only the fact that Jason isn't trying to expand the house at all costs, and that he likes her that stops him from say...doing the same thing and yanking the Empress from Draconus and so on. If that's not possible its going to occur to a lot of Intelligence workers as POSSIBLE.

And thats why leaving behind a few anti-matter bombs should be considered. Nobody except the Karinnes and the Kimdori would know about what happened, not even the syndicate. Especially the syndicate. Now that I've had more time to think about it, the Oracle at the syndicate main headquarters might be able to predict the kidnapping, and that would mean that they would immediately kill the Oracle in the fleet. But if the ship simply blows up, well they will think that has nothing to do with the Oracle and there is no evidence that she didn't die. So even if they predict the demise of the ship, they probably won't have a clue how to go about preventing it if they dont know what is gonna cause it. Sha Ra could get out of the ship and save herself though and they might also decide to move the Oracle, unless they would decide to kill her and let the explosion do the job for them. And when Jason explains it to the Confederation, he could just give the Kimdori spys on board the supership credit for kidnapping the Oracle and destroying the ship to destroy the evidence without explaining exactly how they did it, if he wanted to keep the how a secret.

[SYED]

I wonder how they captured a whole race of telepathic precogs. Sure they might have found then when they had a low tech level, and used advanced technology to overwhelm. While their precog ability is natural, could some of their techniques or experience allow other precogs of differing races to retain their sanity? It takes a telepath to deal with a telepath. So first step is to get precogs in a VR world or dream state. Then train them to use their ability subconsciously. That sounds like it is a tiny bit possible. Usually they would want a telepathic ability to be under conscious control, here they simply implant controls to do the reverse.
As telepaths, they at least can communicate with each other, and share memories. Telepathy can apparently still be used in dreams I think. They are apparently on the same moon.
I wonder why they moved to a moon, their home planet could be indicted by a fleet. I have a question could a moon be moved through a worm hole. I doubt the settlement is in the open air, they are likely underground, contained or even domes. It needs only to survive the transition, so be evacuated. I wonder if the moon is an artificial one, their ships are moon sized. So even if not a moon, it could be a station.

I have to ask, if rescued, those dreamer will defiantly want revenge. They could work with the kimdori to undermine the benga, and free the slaves. I bet the benga also have genetic samples, so able to breed more if necessary.

So it has finally happened, Jason is on the shaman path. If shamans can recieve a communication from dreamers, I wonder if shamans can provide an alternative to nightmares to get precognition so, out do them. We know telepathy can affect dreams, biogenic crystals allow for great interface, and a virtual dream world could be combined with shaman gifts to make something greater. If shamans could protect against the energy beings spying, could they at least interfere with future sight?

Can they adjust the indication shell? So that when the mobile forces attempt to aid the trapped fleet, the outer shell is expanding and trap them in the effect, so able to eliminate them piecemeal.

I wonder what the minimum distance for the wormhole bridge. The ability to recall those with beacons would be awesome. Once they pick up the oracle, could they dump in say some missiles. They likely have such a prized unit deep with in the ship, so any explosion of size could really mess them up. Could the kimdori plant other beacons, but instead an unstable worm hole is created. The spatial distortions could seriously harm any ship.
The thing is wont they notice even a tiny wormhole appearing in the ship, the oracle is likely highly monitored. So they might have a finger on a button when the rescue team shows up. And the kid would be linked and connected to multiple systems, so making it a tricky extraction.
Jason would have to go after the oracle moon, before the benga here tell of the theft. The moment he has stolen one oracle, security on the others will be increased and they would be watching for such an event. So the best option would be to ensure there is no ability to inform the boss left to the benga. So any QE computers linking home have to be eliminated.

Why not make the transform able drones and units be an academy project? Most don't see it as militarily viable, but it is epic science and so cool. The tech could then be adapted with karrine upgrades and actually made viable using biogenics and transmitted power.

I know the consortium is surrendering, but what is the time table. If the benga loose the oracles soon enough, they could regain their freedom, or at least offer a great deal of long term resistance.

[kyli]

And in that instant, he started not being quite so skeptical about things he didn’t believe in. He felt…something. He had no idea what it was, but he sure as fucking hell felt something. A, a, a…pressure emanating from the shaman, like a phantom wind that pressed through them as it radiated out from her. And he wasn’t the only one that felt it. Kyri, Aura, and Kyva also felt it, from their startled expressions…which probably explained why she wanted Aura and Kyva here.

This is a paragraph from tribulation where the Parri shaman completes a ritual at Jason’s house. Does this mean that Kyri, Aura, and Kyva also have shaman abilities? And in the last chapter, Jason speculates that Rann might have shaman abilities, because Amber seems to understand him more than the others. I think Rann isn't the only one.

[SYED]

It seems most races either naturally have telepathy or they make them. I wonder if the UN would start a program to to produce them. It seems like humans are receptive to the telepathic gene, as all the karrine descendants are telepaths. It was posted that the feay were actually a sub species of humans moved from New Zealand in time pbeyond memory. Does that mean it is possible for humanity to be 100% telepathic like the faey? While Jason might not want to institute such a program, I wonder if parents can opt to have their unborn children to be improved.

How wide spread is the knowledge that the Parri shaman abilities is true? They did help to hide ships from the energy beings. With the spread of Oye fruit being sold amongst the confederation, the shaman influence could spread.

[Tuga555]

Well, using a "tachyon bomb/burst" to kill the entanglement computers would be better than the antimatter bomb i think. They should be near the oracle, as it is "the most secure" area in the ship. It would kill the communication from Andromeda and leave Sha Ra "Up creek without a paddle". (i think that's how you Americans say it)

[Belgarion213]

The Faey took a divergent path to the one humanity took if I remember Fel's statement correctly. Human's 'naturally' don't have telepathic powers but the difference between Faey and Human's is very small, and they ARE receptive to carrying the genes that express talent. I'm not sure that human's will ever be 100% telepathic like the Faey is but eventually now that the Faey and human's are interacting the telepathic gene is going to spread, and this is not going to be strictly Kahrine genes but from many of the other houses or commoners. IIRC from Subjugation there were more than a few mention of Faey and Human's hooking up (one of the initial human telepaths Jason was researching was a Faey's lover IIRC).

While Jason is very concerned with eugenics and free choice, in some cases overly concerned, he won't really have any say other than being a allied nation if Kim, or one of the members of the United Nation start offering genetic tweaks to make sure that any children you have are born with telepathy. I would bet than in one or two hundred years, that a noticeable percentage of human's are telepathic. Maybe not 100%, but a noticeable percentage of them I think. Whether that percentage is the result of just natural coupling, deliberate breeding programs, genetic tweakings, or a combination of all three but...its probably going to happen.

[Fel]

Well, using a "tachyon bomb/burst" to kill the entanglement computers would be better than the antimatter bomb i think. They should be near the oracle, as it is "the most secure" area in the ship. It would kill the communication from Andromeda and leave Sha Ra "Up creek without a paddle". (i think that's how you Americans say it)

Congratulations, you get a cookie.

[kyli]

Well, using a "tachyon bomb/burst" to kill the entanglement computers would be better than the antimatter bomb i think. They should be near the oracle, as it is "the most secure" area in the ship. It would kill the communication from Andromeda and leave Sha Ra "Up creek without a paddle". (i think that's how you Americans say it)

Congratulations, you get a cookie.

I think Sba Ra will surrender for sure when they do that. For the first time, i can see the possible end of conviction coming up with a syndicate surrender. I'm really hoping tho that they execute their plan about the rest of the Oracles in Andromeda in this book as well. And i sure hope we get quite a few more chapters too. Its already a pretty long book; the 2nd longest book in the series so far, but i love long books.

[SYED]

I wonder if there are precog sanitariums where those surfer insanity due to visions. Karis could built a mental ospital for precogs of the confederation, to place them in an altered reality while trying to link their gifts to their subconscious.

Due to the sheer size of the fleet, they might have at least more than one QE computer linked to their home territories.

If they capture thousands of enemy ships, they won't be able to properly man or outfit them. It would be simpler for the Karrines as their advanced tech could include a lot of automation. The introduction of bionoids would help alleviate the issue, but only to grav band range of the biogenic relay network. Only the karrine ships would be secure enough to carry a biogenic relay station it self. The ships would represent the ultimate defensive station, so they might not need to deploy them, instead depending on their naval assets.
They could be refitted to help temporily settle consortium civilians, while locating actual world's for them.

[Wolfee]

I wonder if there are precog sanitariums where those surfer insanity due to visions. Karis could built a mental ospital for precogs of the confederation, to place them in an altered reality while trying to link their gifts to their subconscious.

Due to the sheer size of the fleet, they might have at least more than one QE computer linked to their home territories.

If they capture thousands of enemy ships, they won't be able to properly man or outfit them. It would be simpler for the Karrines as their advanced tech could include a lot of automation. The introduction of bionoids would help alleviate the issue, but only to grav band range of the biogenic relay network. Only the karrine ships would be secure enough to carry a biogenic relay station it self. The ships would represent the ultimate defensive station, so they might not need to deploy them, instead depending on their naval assets.
They could be refitted to help temporily settle consortium civilians, while locating actual world's for them.

It is one possibility that they could use them. But that would be rather inefficient. The drives, weapons, shields, etc, etc, etc would need to be replaced at some point... There are a number of better uses.

Imagine what the spoils would mean for the Kirri and other races from low metal areas of the galaxy! What that kind of wealth of metal would mean for they're economy - hundreds of thousands of jobs in their home systems recycling all of that metal for use for the Kirri people.

Also Jason is going to want to get all of the other races out of Kosigi so each of the empires would get 1-2 of the superships specifically to be turned into a shipyard. Imagine being an engineering student at the Academy and working with the Master Builders on designing your home empire's new shipyard out of a massive captured enemy supership. You couldn't wish for a better school project for your resume!

I'm sure the Kimdori and Karinne's would be retrofitting several into very large galaxy exploration ships. Mobile Fortresses that let you move your entire fleet of exploration ships and a large military force to another galaxy in luxurious comfort.

Also food... if done correctly it would mean food would be so much cheaper and much more readily available throughout the galaxy. Remove all the weapons and etc from the ship, peel off some armor to help pay for the project. You'd want special shields to modulate sunlight since there is no atmosphere to do it. You would need to build watering systems, drainage and water purification systems, the list goes on... And then on the surface build a fantastically large greenhouse cover 99% of the hull. You'd want to leave exhaust ports for the engines to move the greenhouse ship if needed, to correct its orbit and or to move it to a new solar system. Also you'd want to have a docking port to a internal dock for freighters, passenger ships and etc. The farmers would live right on the ship...er... greenhouse. Hundreds of thousands of workers per greenhouse would be needed. Imagine this project on your resume as recent graduate of the Academy!

With all the extra resources the Karinne's could now build planetary relocation gates. Basically two supersized hyperspace bridges could be used to scoop up a planet from a dying star or from a star that is going to have a short life span yet has a planet capable of supporting life in orbit around it and move it to a more desirable location within the borders of ones empire. Or there is a planet that is an excellent candidate to be terraformed if moved to a different solar system with plenty of cheap resources to be used to terraform it.

The Karinne's could also retro fit a number of these superships into secret, hidden emergency fall-out shelters for the house. Just install multiple person sized stargates and the civilians walk right through to a safe condo-like-living environment. There could be entire farms on these ships covering hundreds of square miles of internal space. You could have parks and lakes, forests and meadows all build within the safety of a Karinne upgraded supership. There could be a massive shipyard built into each and still have plenty of room for everything else. There could be factories built into these bases to completely rebuild house Karinne from scratch if need be.

You could also turn one of these into a maximum security prison, remove all the offensive weapons, engines, and etc. Add tons of defenses, cells, prison yards, farms and more... Drop it into a remote system with a interdictor and a stargate... galaxy class super-max.

The ideas are endless.

[SYED]

The program is forbidden, yet they still produce biogenic crystals and systems. So why not experiment with new crystals. The originals were made using faey, kimdori and a silicon life form DNA. Why not attempt to use other races DNA, those that pisses mental gifts apart from telekinesis or telepathy. There is a risk that those races would be able to communicate with the new crystals, but highly unlikely. The benefit could be huge, generations will always be desired by other races. When Jason restarted the house, they gathered the other 240 or so generations still alive. Sure in the following years they have had plenty of children, but still a rare species. As the program is banned, their numbers will be limited by basic reproduction. So they need every advantage they can get. The house will soon become an extra galactic power, working on a huge scale.
Imagine if they create crystals use Parri or Oye DNA, potentially granting them shaman like abilities. It is not like there are a huge number of mental gifts that other races posses or that each one will be game changing. But it would ensure the deck will be more likely stacked in the house favor.
If the old karrine house programed telekinesis into the bloodline, I wonder why they never attempted the other mental gifts, even those of other races. Modern science and tech could new solve the issue.
The colonists were mentioned for their empathy, the jakkans I think had a form of clairvoyance, that panther race had an awareness of their people, the dreamers are precogs, the new guys have the ability to naturally hear communion and divine the direction of specific objects. Are there any races that posses a gift that I forgot to mention? If so, please post it. I think at some point it was mentioned, when telepathy rates amongst races were discussed.
Do the shamans counts or even be a viable target?

The New generations were made by a virus triggering the creation of something akin to the original tool used to create generations. Some were changed, others died, but some remained the same. The thing is while the karrine commoners gained no abilities, their gene for telepathy was altered. The testing and comparison of Tim and temika DNA apparently showed this. So does that mean they too might carry an echo of the technique that created the generations. We know that this means most of the human telepaths of earth and the faey of exile. The thing is the kimdori were unable to track the descendants of the karrine commoners in the imperium. I wonder how many of the faey telekinetic capable individuals are the result of this. If they happen to experience the same virus as the empress, a new plague could be created.

The is only two human generations due to their high cancer rates. So the non noble descendants would have greater opportunity to breed, and spread their genes. This happened over 1000 years ago, so even with a slow growth rate, the number of human telepaths could be huge. I am thin kings in the thousands for certain, likely more. It is said some races either had natural telepaths or they created them. Since humans seem so receptive, would it be that troublesome if they offered earth the choice. Telepaths already exist in the universe, it is only leveling the field.